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Author Topic: Some Feedback from recent play  (Read 701 times)

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imported_Witchking20k

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Some Feedback from recent play
« on: December 16, 2013, 03:17:32 PM »
Good Day all

I recently ran a game of Novus while our current GM was unavailable.  The players were new to the system and of varying degrees of RPG experience.  When we wrapped up game play I asked them to provide some feedback for me to pass along.  I'm not going to stick it into one post as we are still in conversation about some of the details....but I figured I could start with one area that seems to be of universal concern.

Skills & Skill Development:  Each Class has somewhere between 7 & 11 Favoured Skills.  There are only 19  in the game.  If one of your players is playing a Human character they can add 3 more to that list.  I understand that Combat Skills, Spell Casting, and Magecraft are developed separately...but, this still means that a character can begin play with somewhere between a third and half of the skills being favoured.

This devalues skills.

The result is that "Skill Based" characters suddenly have to compete with Martial or Magic based characters in areas like Gimmickry, Stealth, and Survival...the very skills that should allow them a niche in which to succeed and differentiate them from other characters.

I wonder if the lists of Favoured skills should be (A) reduced, or (

imported_Rasyr

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Some Feedback from recent play
« Reply #1 on: December 17, 2013, 05:06:03 AM »
Okay, first thing to remember is that the Open Beta period ended back in 2012, so there will be no more changes to the core rules, until I get around to actually doing a revision (which is not planned for at least 5 more years).

However, between now and then, I might do an errata update to the core rules, incorporating any and all errata that has appeared for Novus -- http://www.firehawkgames.biz/?page_id=205 -- and then re-releasing it (this errata correction version would not include any other rule changes.




Good Day all

I recently ran a game of Novus while our current GM was unavailable.  The players were new to the system and of varying degrees of RPG experience.  When we wrapped up game play I asked them to provide some feedback for me to pass along.  I'm not going to stick it into one post as we are still in conversation about some of the details....but I figured I could start with one area that seems to be of universal concern.




That is fine. Also, let them know that they are welcome to join the forums and partake in the discussions as well.




Skills & Skill Development:  Each Class has somewhere between 7 & 11 Favoured Skills.




Each class started with 7 Favored Skills. As explained in Libram Novus #3, each class then received 1 or more additional Favored Skills, to bring them all in line with one another.




 There are only 19  in the game.  If one of your players is playing a Human character they can add 3 more to that list.  I understand that Combat Skills, Spell Casting, and Magecraft are developed separately...but, this still means that a character can begin play with somewhere between a third and half of the skills being favoured.




There are 19 core skills listed, but this is far from the total number of potential skills. Granted, I don't expect more than 4 or 5 any given "bucket skill" specializations, and in fact, the skill page of the character sheet is set to expect about 31 skills in total (based upon specializations), with blank lines for more to be added)



  • Combat Skills -- this is actually 23 different skills (not including any future Combat Styles that might be added), and NO character starts off wit more than 3 of them as Favored (unless using one of their selectable Favored Skills)
  • Crafting - This is one of the bucket skills that can be specialized in lots of different ways
  • Lore - again, can be specialized into many different skills
  • Magecraft - One of the primary ones to be broken down into specializations, but there is no limit here either.
  • Spellcasting -- specialized, but by school, so there are likely to be no more than 2 instances of this skill


This devalues skills.


I don't think it does. At least not in the manner that you are thinking


The result is that "Skill Based" characters suddenly have to compete with Martial or Magic based characters in areas like Gimmickry, Stealth, and Survival...the very skills that should allow them a niche in which to succeed and differentiate them from other characters.


Novus is essentially a skill-based system, first and foremost. That alone means that it is possible for one "character type" to overlap and "invade the niche" of any other character type.

And don't forget that the cost of each rank DOES increase with the number of ranks purchased, as well. Which means that while there will be some overlap, perhaps, at lower levels, those focused skills will be the ones that get the attention as the number of ranks purchased goes up, thus allowing those characters to slip back into their niches as time passes...

And don't forget that one of the benefits of the system being setup this way IS that there CAN BE niche cross-over, so that you do not need one of every character class to have all of the potential skill niches covered. This is extremely helpful for those gaming groups who might not have enough players to handle every niche type.

If a player is deliberately crossing over into the niche held by another character (for more than "just so I can be proficient, in case we need backup, or he is no longer there" scenarios, but to actually compete with him, or to be the "Alpha Character who can do everything better than everybody"), then it might be an idea to have a discussion of the issue with the player about potential playing habits.


I wonder if the lists of Favoured skills should be (A) reduced, or (

  • Each Class chooses 3 Primary Skills from among his Favored Skills. These 3 Skills may have multiple ranks per level purchased, so long as the total number of ranks known is less than 20.
  • For all other Favored Skills, they may have multiple ranks per level purchased, so long as the total number of ranks known is 15 or less.
  • All other skills may have multiple ranks per level purchased up to a maximum of 10 ranks.
  • Once these limits have been reached, the character may only purchase 1 rank per level.


On a separate note: the Nova Roll, Fate Point system, and Boons/Snags went over very well.  I did however have an occasion where  a player added a dice to a skill roll using a Fate Point and rolled a 10 & 1 & 1.  How is this "supposed" to be resolved?  I didn't implode the third dice...


Actually, I would not explode or implode any dice added due to Fate Points spent (perhaps allow a second Fate Point to make it explosive/implosive before it is actually rolled). Considering that the player gets to decide whether to add OR subtract that third die, even an imploding die roll could increase the total skill roll (i.e. subtract a negative means you are actually adding to the result)


It might be handy to create a little index of which rolls can implode/explode and which cannot.  Initiative was elusive as I believe one section said it did and another said it didn't implode/explode...


I think I may need to add errata to clarify this for the core rules. In Libram Novus #8, in the section for Expanded Initiative Options, I do specify that and clarify that initiative IS explosive/implosive.

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imported_Witchking20k

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Some Feedback from recent play
« Reply #2 on: December 17, 2013, 03:02:25 PM »
Thanks for the reply.  I think one of the issues that we ran into was that it was an all-human party.  Everybody got to pick 3 extra Favoured Skills.

I was a huge advocate the the beta's of less is more with skills; and still am.  I don't think the amount of skills is the issue, I just think its the amount of favoured skills IMO.  But, that is easily managed.

Yah, after re-reading my post the example of skill caps is a little convoluted. LOL But, the general idea is to factor in Class so that you have an affinity based advantage for learning.

.

imported_Rasyr

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Some Feedback from recent play
« Reply #3 on: December 17, 2013, 04:53:04 PM »
I like the idea of factoring in Class and I am now planning on making a couple of official options regarding that. In fact, I can think of a few other options that would go well also...

Things like reducing the number of ranks purchasable per level for non-primary skills (primary as defined in the off the cuff options I gave above -- or primary being the specific skills listed in class descriptions (i.e. NOT the "choose 1 additional skill" bits).


Offline Fidoric

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Some Feedback from recent play
« Reply #4 on: December 17, 2013, 07:50:10 PM »
I have recently converted my 30th level fighter from RMSS into a 30th level fighter in Novus and I found that his skills spread is OK. Though a human fighter (one of the most generous combo regarding favored skills) and an additional favored skill purchased at creation, he is not overly competent in many areas. He is very good at heavy blades and a combat styles but those are his only skills over 20 ranks. The skill cost become a heavy factor even with many favored skills. Besides, he had to put some ranks in none favored skills and that costs a lot.
I have uploaded him to the PC gallery if you want to see what he looks like.

imported_Witchking20k

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Some Feedback from recent play
« Reply #5 on: December 17, 2013, 08:05:07 PM »
Tim; what you are describing is very much what I was thinking.  I was thinking you would choose a few "Primary" Skills from the favoured Skills list, and the rest would revert to being "Secondary: Skills.  This also allows you to create specialist characters whom will develop their chosen skills easier.