Charging and running away

[imported_kustenjaeger]

Greetings

I tested a Minstrel and Wizard against a couple of Orcs the other day.  The orcs only had falchions while the Minstrel had a composite bow and main gauche and the Wizard had Elemental Bolt and a staff.  The groups started about 60' away with the adventurers having Initiative.

On round 1 the orcs could close by running (20'/AP) or running and walking (10'/AP) but because it costs 4AP to melee (3AP if fast attack) then they cannot fight the adventurers in the round although they could get next to them.  What should they do? 

When the orcs did close in round 2 the fight quickly went their way and I couldn't work out how or if the higher Initiative adventurers could run away from the melee and, if they could, what damage the orcs could inflict as they left - have I missed something?

Regards

Edward

[imported_Rasyr]

On round 1 the orcs could close by running (20'/AP) or running and walking (10'/AP) but because it costs 4AP to melee (3AP if fast attack) then they cannot fight the adventurers in the round although they could get next to them.  What should they do? 

Moving Strike -- Running, they could move up to 60' (and do an extra 15 hits of damage if they strike), but they get -2 to both their Attack Bonus and DEF (page 39 of the free version of the Open Beta, version 0.4).

This is how characters charge/attack in a single round.

When the orcs did close in round 2 the fight quickly went their way and I couldn't work out how or if the higher Initiative adventurers could run away from the melee and, if they could, what damage the orcs could inflict as they left - have I missed something?

Disengaging from melee is more problematic. Quite simply, it will need to depend upon HOW the players want to disengage. Simply turning and running may work, but might give the foes a chance to make a strike at them.

The best method will likely involve waiting on the foe to take action first (holding an action), and then dodging the foe (or Fighting Defensively), and then moving away at full speed. As GM, you could allow using certain skills in this -- for example, having them roll Acrobatics to dodge away from the foe, or using Athletics, and treating Boon Points as AP that can be used to move further away from the foe (i.e. make a TN 18 Athletics roll, player gets a grand total or 39, giving him 2 Boon Point. You allow him to convert them to AP for additional movement (i.e. 7 AP of movement instead of 5)

There are any number of ways to actually handle this, and most all of them WILL be correct - depending upon the actual situation at hand.

[imported_kustenjaeger]

Greetings

Thanks.  I'm using the Deluxe version 0.4 so I assume this is p.43?  There's no reference to the -2 (except under Run where it applies to any skill for each AP spent)?  And the basic orc doesn't have CPs spent on this combat move - how does someone who hasn't purchased the Combat Move do a charge?

Am I missing something between versions? 

Regards

Edward

[imported_Rasyr]

Thanks.  I'm using the Deluxe version 0.4 so I assume this is p.43?  There's no reference to the -2 (except under Run where it applies to any skill for each AP spent)?

Look at the entry for the Moving Strike on Page 43, and you will see the following:

Code:

Moving Strike (U 4/ I 3/II 2)
AB: -2
DEF: -2
AP: +1
Effects: The character moves at a run towards foe and
makes an attack as he reaches him. He may spend
up to 3 of the 5 AP required for this Combat Move
approaching the foe. Each AP spent in moving adds
an extra 5 hits of damage to those dealt by the attack.
If the character would require more than 3 AP to
approach the foe, this Combat Move may not be used.

See the rows that begin with "AB" and "DEF"? Those are the modifiers to the character's Attack Bonus (AB), and his DEFENSE (DEF) when using that move, and the AP line says that it requires 1 AP more than a normal attack (so 5 AP instead of 4). And then the effects section says that you can use 3 of those 5 AP in moving towards your target.

And the basic orc doesn't have CPs spent on this combat move -

Actually, the monster stats/descriptions do NOT spend all of the monster's DP each level. The stats/descriptions only give the most commonly required skills. This leaves it open for the GM to include a couple of small bonuses or adjustments of his own. For example, he could add a couple of  combat moves, or increase skill ranks by a few points for a specific monster. Basically, room is left for GMs to customize the monsters if they want.

If you look at my answers regarding monsters in this thread - http://www.firehawkgames.biz/forum/index.php?topic=572.0 - you can easily assign a specific class to a sentient monster and adjust things accordingly (for all intents and purposes, it is best to think of the sentient monster races as being Fighters, Archers, or Rogues most often, and only rare individuals can be from other classes

how does someone who hasn't purchased the Combat Move do a charge?

For this, I refer you to page 19, to the third paragraph under the heading "Resolving Skills", where it says:

Code:

Characters may always
attempt to accomplish physical
skills even if they do not have any ranks in the skill. When
doing so, the TN of the task is increased by 5 points.
Conversely, instead of raising the TN of the task, the GM
could just assign a -5 modifier to the player's roll.

Am I missing something between versions? 

No, you aren't. It is just part of the problem with an Open Beta. While I know the rules and know where to find what I want or need. I have to keep in mind that not everybody does (hence the reason for the Open Beta, to allow for feedback, to help improve the product overall).

I should put something in that specifies that Combat Moves should be treated like untrained physical skills when somebody is trying them without having purchased them.

I hope all this helps. 

[imported_kustenjaeger]

Greetings

Thanks.  I've no idea how I missed the AB/DEF/AP references in Moving Strike!

The point about monster building (spare CPs and classes) is really useful and I assume will appear somewhere in future iterations?

A reference in the introduction to Combat Moves saying that any can be performed untrained at -5/TN+5 would be really helpful.

In this particular case an untrained individual would be at -7 (unskilled plus effect of moving strike)?

Is there any form of 'knock down' or other combat move to unbalance an opponent or is this effectively dealt with by applying combat boons?

Regards

Edward

[imported_Rasyr]

In this particular case an untrained individual would be at -7 (unskilled plus effect of moving strike)?

Correct, -7 to AB, and -2 to DEF.

Is there any form of 'knock down' or other combat move to unbalance an opponent or is this effectively dealt with by applying combat boons?

There will be. The core rules only contain a small selection. There are all sorts of additions that can eventually be made to the list. The main point of including the ones we did was to provide players with a small starting selection, so that the general idea of Combat Moves was incorporated into the core rules, allowing for further expansion, without adding something that alters the overall balance of the rules, later on. (if that makes sense)